Updated: 8/1/2025 4:18 p.m. ET: In a statement to Kotaku, a spokesperson for Valve said that while Mastercard did not communicate with it directly, concerns did come through payment processor and banking intermediaries. They said payment processors rejected Valve’s current guidelines for moderating illegal content on Steam, citing Mastercard’s Rule 5.12.7.
“Mastercard did not communicate with Valve directly, despite our request to do so,” Valve’s statement sent over email to Kotaku reads. “Mastercard communicated with payment processors and their acquiring banks. Payment processors communicated this with Valve, and we replied by outlining Steam’s policy since 2018 of attempting to distribute games that are legal for distribution. Payment processors rejected this, and specifically cited Mastercard’s Rule 5.12.7 and risk to the Mastercard brand.”
Rule 5.12.7 states, “A Merchant must not submit to its Acquirer, and a Customer must not submit to the Interchange System, any Transaction that is illegal, or in the sole discretion of the Corporation, may damage the goodwill of the Corporation or reflect negatively on the Marks.”
It goes on, “The sale of a product or service, including an image, which is patently offensive and lacks serious artistic value (such as, by way of example and not limitation, images of nonconsensual sexual behavior, sexual exploitation of a minor, nonconsensual mutilation of a person or body part, and bestiality), or any other material that the Corporation deems unacceptable to sell in connection with a Mark.”
Violations of rule 5.12.7 can result in fines, audits, or companies being dropped by the payment processors.
since they deny it, then everyone should just revert whatever was done to censor stuff.
So much fucking censorship and agenda-pushing on the internet.
It makes me sick how many useful idiots are being herded like sheep just to satisfy those with more money than them.
Put simply, we allow all lawful purchases on our network.
As Valve correctly points out, this is a blatant & outright lie. They have cut off any number of legal entities over pressure from politicians or groups. Now they have to own it.
I mean, their own Rule 5.12.7 has that “or” in it, which includes transactions that are fully lawful but “may damage the goodwill of the corporation”.
You will find such language pretty much everywhere. And there are reasons for it. A good example are certain drugs that are technically not illegal. Because they have not been officially classified yet.
That used to be a thing here in Sweden some time ago, where they’d just change some little compound and could technically, legally sell it online until it was deemed otherwise. Because it’s now technically a new formula. Once it was classified, they just repeated the proceas.
MasterCard might not want to be seen as an enabler in the drug trade. So while it’s technically legal. They don’t want anything to do with it. And would like the option to take action.
And according to the articles. It’s not MasterCard pointing to that regulation, but the processors. As MasterCard notes. They’re not a bank, they’re not processing your payment. They just provide the technology to do so.
Furthermore. I’m quite amazed that people seem to think Valve is this really good company that we can all trust and take their word on. Valve says one thing. MasterCard says another. I wouldn’t take either one of them on just their word. Better to take a step back, and see how it develops so you don’t make yourself a useful idiot.
I’m voting for Donald Trump because of Collective Shout.
Since neither candidate represents the working class and all we have is a culture war, I’m going to fight back against censorship wherever I can.
All of the people on the left pushing censorship and attacking freedom of speech are directly responsible for driving me further to the right.
You mean the guy that is president right now, while this is happening, that is doing nothing about it because he’s too busy dealing with his pedophile rape escapades becoming public knowledge?
Not to mention: the guy that can’t run for president again (yet)
I’m sorry. Did you just say you want to vote Trump because you think they’re against censorship? The guy that threatens journalists, and politicians that report or say bad things about them. Do you not think that’s censorship?
I don’t even have a bone in this fight. I just want to understand the thought process.
Censorship means different things to different people. For those on the left censorship means suppression of liberal ideas, suppression of journalism exposing corruption and brutality, suppression of peoples history. For those on the right censorship means they can’t say the n word anymore.
Would you care to guess what censorship means to haloduder?
No don’t want to guess. I’d rather ask him directly instead of making assumptions.
Collective Shout is a conservative, forced-birth anti-trans sex-nagative women-patronizing christian organization masquerading as feminist.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melinda_Tankard_Reist
They call themselves “feminist” but they are as “feminist” as the guys who finally allowed women to drive in Saudia Arabia.
Upset about conservatives and their puritanical practices. Votes for puritanical conservatives. What, do you think because he fucks kids he will allow your gooner game?
Useful idiots on the left are the only ones attacking freedom of speech, saying its a dogwhistle.
Useful idiots on the left are the only ones trying to control narratives by controlling what information people are allowed to share.
You are one of the worst cucks I’ve ever seen. Go read this guy’s comment history, holy shit.
My brother in Christ they are a self proclaimed anti queer conservative organization. Do you want to be right? Do you care if you’re correct or not? Or do you want to blame everything on the ghosts in your head?
Ah yes, because the left wing is famous for the proliferation of requiring a government issued ID to use the internet in ways that make them uncomfortable.
Collective Shout is a conservative organization you numbskull.
So that means the left isn’t censoring me as much as the right?
Tbh liberals love censorship as much as conservatives (see the proscription of Palestine Action in the UK).
But it’s a bit silly saying you are going to vote for a conservative because a conservative group is censoring you.
I guess only in a country that is so far leaning on the right thinks that liberals are “on the left”.
Well that’s why I didn’t say “leftists.” But if we’re continuing to be honest, leftist governments also censor. I don’t think you can find any ideology that doesn’t censor, actually.
These are Australian conservatives, they don’t value freedom of speech as much as American conservatives.
They are willing to abuse censorship to push their agendas, just like American liberals.
You know that American conservatives have been banning books from libraries, and banning topics like racism and homophobia from being talked about in schools, right? American conservatives love censoring anything they don’t agree with. They are the original snowflakes.
I suspect your butt is just chapped because you can’t drop a hard “r” on BlueSky.
Hi. Texas conservatives in Houston took over the city schools and removed libraries to create a prison inside the school itself. Fuck you and your talks of censorship. You don’t know censorship and think the conservacucks don’t do it because they ain’t targeting your white cis heterosexual ass. You have no opinion worth censoring because your just that white bread bland.
You’re a good example of the average dumbass American.
This is what we call ragebait! There’s too much going on in the news to even bother with this type of ‘person’.
Not really. You don’t like what I have to say, so you’re trying to get me censored by crying ‘ragebait.’
You’re another example of why censorship on the left drives people further to the right.
I’m going to block you now since I can tell you need the last reply.
That’s not censorship. That’s just social consequences.
That’s some strong protection. You’ve spent the last hour getting the last word in on everyone replying to you.
Don’t feed the trolls.
Voting for Donald Trump in which election?
He’s on his last legal term
reddthat please please add a downvote option
But the people on the right are also pushing for censorship. You’re just choosing what flavour of censorship.
In America you don’t have any other parties with more moderate idealogies either. It’s either the one or the other.
So before you go voting for a literal criminal as the opposition, why not first burn down your shitty system and rebuild something better.
The people on the right aren’t censoring me for disagreeing with them.
You’re really not paying attention, then. Because that’s exactly what they’re doing.
Where? I can say whatever I want on 4chan, but I come to any of the liberal social media sites and get banned for disagreeing with the crowd.
You aren’t being banned. You’re are being fact checked, cuck.
Freedom of speech is not the same thing as "freedom from consequences for saying something idiotic’
Sure buddy. Let’s just ignore Twatter and Facebook like that.
So obviously somebody is lying. I really don’t understand why Valve or Itch would be the ones lying about this. My money is on the group of self righteous censorship soldiers with too much time on their hands, and the payment companies. I could always be wrong I though.
MasterCard is so big they don’t even know what all their departments are doing. The PR department probably asked a couple of the top level execs if they were pushing for this and they said no so they claimed it didn’t happen.
MasterCard knows exactly what they’re doing.
executive leadership is varying degrees of Christian nationalist and trump supporters.
source: me, I know people.
they’re blaming it on the middle men
In a statement to Kotaku, a spokesperson for Valve said that while Mastercard did not communicate with it directly, concerns did come through payment processor and banking intermediaries.
Not necessarily. Valve says they haven’t heard from Mastercard directly. Is there evidence of Itch.io having been approached at all? It seems to me that they just made the move to delist and investigate to be safe in the wake of Valve’s rule changes.
We have seen the same behavior out of the credit card companies before. Its pretty clear that they do pressure companies to remove content they don’t approve of. Its censorship and its legal since the companies are not the government. They are just tied in at a high level to the banking industry. Its a good example of how lack of regulation harms both creators and consumers.
It lets a bunch of poorly adjusted individuals force their personal mental problems on us all.
Taking away our freedom of speech is something to go to war over.
If this trend of giving all the government power to companies continues, well, let’s just say I’m glad we have the 2nd amendment to fight back against tyranny.
I’m not going to live in a reddit cuck-world without a fight.
If nobody takes responsibility, then they should all just agree that this was a big misunderstanding and reinstate the titty games.
Collective Shout says it wasn’t their fault, MC and Visa say it wasn’t their fault, Steam and Itch say it wasn’t their fault. Conclusion? No one is to blame! No one did it! What’s more, it didn’t even happen!! it was all a figment of our imagination!
Which sounds to me like Steam and Itch could restore everything. Unless MC/Visa wants to publicly say they can’t?
I mean, PayPal has not denied responsibility so far. Which is pretty interesting
They must be like the guy who is involved in the mischief but since he is not as visible as the others, he pretends that the issue is not with him to see if he gets away with it.
Gee golly I accidentally dropped internet privacy into the garbage and almost threw it out with the trash. Oops didnt mean to! Silly me.
Gotta love it when companies put something in their legal agreements that just says “we can do whatever the fuck we want.” Is the rest of the wall of text just there to hide that somewhere someone won’t read?
nonconsensual mutilation of a person or body part
I feel like a strict reading of this rule would also put a lot of fighting games, shooters, horror games etc in the not approved category
I think some christian items could also be affected, like the bible. Cane and Able, crucifixion, etc are all in that book
Also incest
And circumcision of children.
Good vibes all around
No cell phone, no internet. Just people being people. Really living in the moment. Really knowing what its like to be human.
The good old days.
Also encouraging your neighbors to rape your own daughters instead of the visiting angels.
nonconsensual mutilation of a person or body part
All action movies should removed from streaming.
it would put circumcision too, but the USA doesn’t care
Right now in Rimworld I am sending child soldiers to bring more ammo to the mortars that are busy pounding away at some primitive tribesmen that are angry at me for dumping a few tons of toxic waste on their home or something.
Those that survive the mortar bombardment will be lobotomised and enslaved. If they have enough limbs remaining to be useful to me I will probably use a few of them as slaves and the rest will be sold to the empire. Any that the empire don’t want will be harvested for organs and dumped in a corpse pit.
I didn’t ask if the tribesmen consented to any of this.
Is there really a game that allows you to do all that??!!
Honestly, that’s pretty tame for Rimworld.
I keep trying to learn rimworld. I drop out of most tutorials some time after building a refrigerator. Any recommendations on how to get further along? This is a game I’ll love once I know it but I’m not there yet.
Do the relaxed scenario girl and a lower difficulty for an easier time. Drop in a year round grow area, and mountainous area to mine a base into the mountain.
Mortal Kombat is gone.
Diablo 2, corpse explosion!
Rust, just rust in general.
Oh did you not read the years and years of actions religious groups did to snuff games and movies?
Mutilation seems to imply more than just violence or killing. For example, Days Gone has a scene very early that involves flaying someone’s skin off, I would imagine that type of stuff would qualify.
Wouldn’t that have artistic value? Since that adds to the story.
That’s the thing, who defines what artistic value is? I’ve seen some pretty creative pornography over the years. Is that artistic value? I’ve seen very creative depictions of violence and uses of profanity too. What about on the other end of the spectrum, Is Tetris have artistic value?
I think pornography is an “art” the same way gastronomy is an “art”. Both serve a simple function: one to arouse you, the other to be enjoyable food to eat.
I think the more general definition of art is something that generates more complex emotions and thoughts.
Tetris is artsy as shit, especially with that kickass score, Korobeiniki.
For a better example, maybe contrast it against the more generic marvel movies.
I was trying to keep it limited to gaming and Tetris was the most basic one that came to mind. How about Pong?
Also not knocking these games at all. Just trying to make a point.
That’s true but anyone agaimt its inclusion would just say it doesn’t add to the story. “Clearly it detracts from the story, as the player would be distracted by the horrific event instead of enjoying the game” -some hypothetical mastercard Exec, right before fining Valve.
It’s not a court, so there’s no appeal from that, unless there’s an appeal granted by the contract itself.
They didnt have to show it so explicitly, although I’m not sure simply implying mutilation would qualify too.
Its hard to say what the right level of shock for that kind of thing is, it probably should just be restricted to adults only.
I guess turn the boobs butts and dicks up to 10,000 then. In every game.
Its time for Gordon freeman to do unholy things with a headcrab!
Like this?
Lamar IS fully debeaked, after all… ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Oh god why did you have to put that image in my head. No wonder it hides in the vents
“Mastercard did not communicate with Valve directly, despite our request to do so,” Valve’s statement sent over email to Kotaku reads. “Mastercard communicated with payment processors and their acquiring banks. Payment processors communicated this with Valve
This whole thing reads like a telephone game where nobody wants to take any responsibility.
Honestly, I don’t care if MasterCard doesn’t want to take responsibility. It was their rule and their intermediaries that caused the situation and they did not intervene when valve tried to reach out directly.
They are responsible through action or inaction, no matter how they try to deny it.
It seems like, if they’re publicly denying responsibility, Steam and Itch now have legal cover to restore everything.
I’m not a lawyer, etc. etc., but don’t public statements from these kinds of entities inform how these clauses can be enforced?
they did the exact same thing in the porn industry. naturally Visa and MC didn’t communicate directly with the individual porn companies. So thats’ how places like CCBill and what have you took off. and then Visa and MC laid out their weird rules to CCBill who then passed it along to the individual companies.
At work when no one wants to pick up a task, I issue the “slopey shoulders” award.
CollectiveShout did
“Nonconsensual mutilation of a person or body part” includes just about every fighter or shooter game. They really want to have COD delisted over this?
To be fair, that would be fucking hilarious.
Unironically, COD getting delisted would probably get mainstream media coverage and legitimate outrage from people who “don’t play video games” but actually do.
you’re missing some context in that.
“The sale of a product… which is patently offensive and lacks serious artistic value… (such as… images of… Nonconsensual mutilation of a person or body part”
insert joke about COD lacking artistic value, but clearly there is more to COD than just body mutilation.
Artistic value is subjective.
That clause shouldn’t hold up in a court.
“Patently offensive” and “lacks serious artistic value” are entirely subjective classifications. With those restrictions, any game with country music should be delisted.
Man, if i could get a patent on offending people . . . money, money money, win win win.
Wagner and Mahler: Listen, we have some really badass tracks. Use them! And nobody would dare to call this music “not art enough”.
Some kid on COD said he fucked my mom and then he called me a faggot.
I love how this has damaged Mastercards brand much more than anything Valve sells. MC would rather pressure Valve for selling NSFW games, than clean up billionaires buying and trafficking children.
Mastercard is living the corporate dream. They’ve colluded their way to a near monopoly and don’t have to care about the value of their brand. They just have to be invisible enough that they don’t pull heat for something or other from various governments.
Hey, Mastercard don’t deal with those transactions. Too traceable! Diplomatic narcotics and crypto have less of a paper trail…
deleted by creator
Brilliant, just make your rules vague and force everyone else down the chain to self-censor. Surely this will result in the best outcome.
Fucking mastercard
It’s not even that vague.
Valve basically said: “we are not doing anything illegal”.
To which mastercard responded: “yeah but you’re making us look bad, so tough”.
To which mastercard responded
I don’t think you read this properly. Mastercard didn’t respond at all.
Of course they did.
They just did so from behind a veil of plausible deniability.
You think a citatation of a specific mastercard contract clause came from a concerned partner?
A lawyer for a processor like PayPal or Stripe could easily have gone “uh, the Mastercard contract clause prohibits this”.
And PayPal is well known for doing shitty things, so it wouldn’t surprise me.
Maybe.
But Valve asked mastercard directly.
A lack of a response is a also a response, in this case essentially an endorsement of whatever their partner was telling Valve.
So you think Valve is lying?
What?
Did you not read literally the first line?
In a statement to Kotaku, a spokesperson for Valve said that while Mastercard did not communicate with it directly, concerns did come through payment processor and banking intermediaries
Yes.
Plausible deniability.
“Oh so sorry that wasn’t us, one of our partners just overzealously applied or policies”
deleted by creator
Removed by mod
or any other material that the Corporation deems unacceptable to sell in connection with a Mark
which could be just anything.
NugganMastercard has decided the following things are abominations, and are therefore unacceptable to sell:Cats, the colour blue, oysters, mushrooms, chocolate, garlic, cheese, the smell of beets, jigsaw puzzles, and rocks
Obviously our solution here is to send a pissed off bard to beat up Mastercard, then.
A few of those even have actual real live victims, unlike video game porn. This whole debacle is truly absurd.
These comments are what is absurd ngl.
Get a grip.
wat
Whoat?
If they just wanted to follow the law, they could have left it at “don’t sell anything illegal” without all the extra “brand damage” nonsense.
Up to the third comma, yes, but all the rest seems to go beyond that pretty arbitrarily.
When they say anything that “may damage the goodwill of the corporation”, and qualify that with “in the sole discretion of the Corporation” that just means “anything we don’t want to be associated with, and we will be the judge of that”.
That’s what makes it so vague, how is a Merchant or an Acquirer supposed to know what Mastercard might find damaging to the goodwill? They have to guess, or use trial and error*. Most will just err on the side of caution, which means customers get blocked from even more purchases, just to be safe.
* Or talk to Mastercard, which Valve apparently tried, but they wouldn’t respond.
When they say anything that “may damage the goodwill of the corporation”,
Looks like MasterCard is going to have to ban MasterCard because of all the damage they’ve done to MasterCard’s goodwill.
Their rules seem to just follow the law
Whose law? The US? UK? Netherlands? Japan? Or Singapore?
That’s why it’s vague.
It’s much worse than that. How they word it is “if it may damage the public image of mastercard”. And they don’t review the content, they review the means used to prevent the damage to their brand.
So valve doesn’t even need to have anything that actually damage mastercard brand, it just need to be that mastercard is not comfortable enough with the measures used to prevent it.
Like buying anything would actually damage the brand of Mastercard. It’s such a nonsensical excuse that I’m surprised nobody laughed in their face.
Yeah, right up until assholes start posting “MASTERCARD SELLS SMUT INCEST HENTAI GAMES” on TikTok. Then it’s a problem, and MasterCard considers that damaging to the brand.
There’s really nothing stopping anyone from posting that right now. That’s the quality level of most of the online content nowadays.
That’s my point. They are posting it, and MasterCard does consider it harmful to the brand, so now we’re here.
No, the rules don’t (that’s why it’s been fine for 7 years), and you used a derogatory term so cry harder about your downvotes.
